Really, visa are just trouble. It's becoming difficult even to enter US from EU if it's not just the once-in-a-lifetime vacation ...

Being borderless is just what I love most of my dear European Union. I fear that this paradise may be end soon as well ... damn paranoia.

Michael, it is not a contest, it is a frustration. For a Chinese to experience humiliation and utter condemnation, there is no better place than America embassies or immigration services. For a Chinese to get an America visa is a privilege and to some America’s mind, to get a Chinese visa is a right. To my amazement, I just witnessed a Caucasian America loudly demanded to see a Chinese visa officer’s manager (his word), because he didn’t get a visa at once.

It is a worrisome trend for various countries to tighten up immigration laws, it as also an opportunity for China. Just I myself know people educated from Cambridge, Harvard, U California, Columbia U. went back China. It is my hope that China will keep her door open to attract intelligent people and tourism. So for those turned down by other countries for no reason, come to China, we welcome you!

Good luck, Michael, I really think you will get your visa. Unlike getting an America visa, if you are turned down once, you are fried, as long as you get all your proper documents together, you will get a Chinese visa.

I cannot believe I left another message here. Earlier I was so disgusted by some of the languages on your website. Good luck!

A really fat American is waiting in line at immigration in some small airport in Central Asia. The line is really long and he notices a this super fat Chinese guy standing right in the next line over. Surprised he says,
"Man, you are really fat!"

The Chinese guy takes it in stride, replying, "Hey! Take a look at yourself in the mirror-- sheesh!"

The American guy mutters, "What is this some kinda contest?"

Nope, it's not contest, it's called ironic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Situational_irony.jpg

Good luck with your visa. You might wanna keep honning those ethno-stereotyping super-power skills-- you can always put them on your resume!

I'm just kidding around. Actually that pickle king story of yours was the best thing I have read online this year. Really great. Can't wait for the movie! I know just the perfect guy who could play the pickle too...

Michael, seems like you're not alone. See the TIME magazine story:

Tuesday, Jul. 01, 2008
Olympics a Bust for Beijing Business
By Austin Ramzy/Beijing

Even as Beijing prepares to welcome the world for the Summer Olympics, some of the city's foreign residents are planning their farewell parties. China's epic economic transformation has, in recent years, swelled the city's expatriate population to an estimated 250,000. While hardly the most comfortable city, Beijing offered cheap food and lodging, and the opportunity to live in one of the world's most important emerging centers of commerce and the arts. But just as the city prepares to make its international debut by hosting the Olympics in August, many of those expats have found themselves forced to leave as a result of tightened visa restrictions imposed as part of the security arrangements for the Games.

Sabrina Mondschein, a 24-year-old American, came to Beijing last year after spending a year studying in the central Chinese city of Xi'an. She began work last fall at a small educational foundation and traveled back to the U.S. the following spring to apply for a yearlong work visa. But after returning to China, and inadvertently overstaying a temporary tourist visa, Mondschein's application for a work visa was rejected. Officials told her she didn't have enough experience with the foundation to serve as a representative in China. "I'm baffled," Mondschein says. "I don't feel angry; I don't have any bitterness. At the end of the day you're still a guest of someone else's country. It's just sobering."

It's not only long-term residents who have had nasty surprises from the Chinese authorities — business travelers and tourists have also had problems getting visas for China this summer. As a result, despite expectations of a tourist boom, the number of foreign visitors to the capital last month was actually down in comparison to last year. Some large events have been called off or rescheduled, such as a four-day rock concert that authorities ordered be held only after the Games. Security forces have stepped up patrols in neighborhoods with high concentrations of foreigners, and the Olympic organizing committee published an extensive list of rules for foreigners planning to visit during the Games. For an event meant to highlight how much China has opened up in recent decades, the pre-Olympics jitters appear to be prodding the authorities to tighten up rather than relax their social controls.

Anxieties increased after the Olympic torch was greeted with large protests during some of the international legs of its relay last spring — the government fears similar demonstrations could hit Beijing in August. In a list of 57 rules for foreigners visiting during for the Olympics, the Beijing organizing committee declared that no protest or demonstration could be held without registering with the authorities. "Illegal gatherings, processions, demonstrations and failure to comply can result in fines or legal punishment," the rules state. Political protest banners are also prohibited from stadiums.

An even bigger concern is terrorism. The Beijing subway system began security checks at entrances on Sunday, and heavily armed police have begun patrolling some parts of the capital. Officials have said that Beijing will have an anti-terrorism force of nearly 100,000 police, paramilitary troops and the elite Snow Wolf commando unit. In March, authorities announced what they said was a failed terror attack on a flight to Beijing from the city of Urumuqi, capital of the restive western Xinjiang region. The government blamed the attack, allegedly involving a failed attempt to set a fire in the aircraft's lavatory, on separatists from the Muslim Uighur ethnic group. But human rights groups complain that the threat warnings lack specifics, and could be used to justify political crackdowns. (Interpol and the U.S. State Department, however, have also issued warnings of possible terror attacks during the Games.)

The jittery climate has clouded the expectations of hoteliers and other entrepreneurs hoping to profit from this summer's expected travel boom. "I was really looking forward to a phenomenal year, and that has slowly been tempered by the visa restrictions," says Derek Flint, general manager of the Ritz-Carlton Beijing, Financial Street. In May 346,000 foreigners visited the capital, down 12% from the previous year's figure, according to the Beijing Tourism Administration. "May and June have been tough months. July will also be a tough month before the Olympics," says Damien Little, a Beijing-based director for Horwath HTL, a hotel consulting firm. While most of the top hotels are fully booked for the Games, mid-range accommodations still have vacancies. "The four-star and three-star market has perhaps more than 50% of the rooms available," says Little.

The economic pain is felt well beyond the hospitality industry. Business groups complain that the visa rules are keeping overseas investors from visiting factories, and blocking retailers from attending trade fairs. In Hong Kong, the autonomously governed Chinese city that is a key entry point to the mainland, long lines of people wait to plead their case to officials at the Chinese visa office. "It's really a hassle and adds a lot of time and expense," says Richard Vuylsteke, president of the American Chamber of Commerce in Hong Kong. "Nothing is insurmountable, but it increases the cost of business and makes people think twice before going in." The group sent letters of complaint to the Chinese foreign ministry and the Hong Kong government. But they don't expect to see any improvement before the Games' conclusion. "Our interest is that things go back where they were before after Olympics," Vuylsteke says. "Otherwise this will have an impact on business plans."

The visa problems are affecting more than just business, however. Farnoosh Famouri, a 25-year-old Australian, plans to marry her American fiance in Beijing on July 6. The couple, who met while working in the Chinese capital, invited 30 friends and relatives to join them, before realizing that they might not be able to renew their own visas in time. After meeting with several denials, Famouri returned to the visa office with her visiting parents for one last attempt. Upon learning that she planned to be wed in China, the officer extended Famouri visa for two weeks. "I was so happy and so excited after three months of so much stress," she says. Still, she has to wait to learn if her fiance's visa can be extended as well.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1819373,00.html

@ Chinese people arn't alone. Many many people, including myself from an English speaking country, have experienced the "tai mafan" bureaucracy that is U.S immigration. Lets hope Michael gets his visa.

Please keep posting here Tong, the more civil discussions and posters here the better.

Michael, any chance of menacing/ annoying/ frustrating the State Administration of Foreign Experts Affairs into speeding up the two minute process of issuing you a new letter.

He he, naive sometimes, aren’t I.

I'm lucky that because I'm married to a Chinese National, I'm here on an "L" family visa, went through a lot of paperwork for that, and wonder sometimes if that visa will become suspect.

None the less, I can sympathize with the Chinese feeling of "it's difficult to get a US visa" from our experience. While working here, first two years we were married my wife couldn't accompany me to U.S. on home leave because the U.S. embassy wouldn't issue a tourist visa. Guangzhou Consulate insisted that she apply for a U.S. Green card. Didn't matter that she didn't really want to immigrate to the U.S.,just visit. Didn't matter that a co-worker's Korean wife could get a 5 year visitor's visa. So, the long process of obtaining the green card ensued.

Interestingly enough, not only is my wife vocally unsympathetic toward foreigners' visa problems in China, "do what is correct, file the paperwork and get the right visa" but she's now very vocal on the issue of illegal immigration in the U.S. "kick the illegal aliens out, I had to go through the process, they should too!"

As it is, a lot of people here in Guangdong, long time expats on "Z" visas are just saying "heck with it they don't want us here anyway, I"m done." Going home!

I think a lot of expats feel betrayed, especially the ones that followed the rules and are now finding out the rules changed suddenly. We liked working here, liked the culture and the people, put down roots here and actually preferred it to U.S. Now we're being told to leave. Reminds me of when I first started here 10 years ago, the warning "don't put down roots or invest in anything you can't walk away from, keep your suitcase packed and your passport in your pocket and a thousand bucks in your briefcase, the government could change at any second and kick us out. Maybe coming true, at least we all feel that way now.

oh god, you just made my day. hahah. Karma sucks doesnt it?

micahel, you gotta get me that consulate women's phone number, shes my new hero, haha

let me break it down for everyone. If you're a young western male, who works for a company that doesnt do shit, i.e. teach english or its nets sales are less than that of a street vendor, chances are, the visa offices are going to be like, "deadbeat foreigner, visa denied, NEXT!" All these foreigners do for china is fill the coffers of sunlitun(r)

but if you work for a large corporation that actually does real work in china, you have no problems with visas. i.e. my south korean colleagues.

dont hold you breath michael, consulates now are on high alert to screen through every invitation letter to weed out the aforementioned type of worthless foreigner. chances are, if you had to leave china to get your Z visa, you got little chance of getting one. at best, they are going to give you like a one month F or L visa, that can be extended twice for 30 days each, for a total of 90 stay in china.

I usually dont bask in joy at the misfortune of others, but its about time foreigners in china are put in their place, to let them know they arent god's gift to the developing world. and like someone said briliiantly above,

foreigners have to know that coming to another country to live and work is a privilege, not a right.

The rest of world feels this away about the US, so should you.

I know what you are doing Mike and I like the way you didn't put Foreign Expert in inverted commas. Please don't tell me you actually believe it.

Cripes, if Michael bothers you so much then why must you persit here? Simply remove this site from your "favorite" list.

i hardly think westerners think their "god's gift to the developing world". while there certainly are deadbeat foreigners, and i've met quite a few, it's pretty shitty for those who are hoping to come and make a real difference while experiencing a different way of life. i hear all these people here who are quite seriously basking in the misfortune of others. well that's fine if it works for you, but you should realize that after a certain point, it's just going to lead to the country becoming more closed and xenophobic. more than that, people are going to stop trying so hard to come to china, let alone care.

yeah, we're well aware that the US is crap for getting a visa. i'm not a fan of it and would love to see it change. unfortunately it's the rest of the world that's moving in that direction.

china already charged an extra $100 for americans on an otherwise $30 visa. brasil has the same charge, with an explicit note that it's in response to the US being crap about visas. US visa woes are hardly a secret, and there's hardly a thing i can do about it, despite my sincere wish that i could.

If it is so much hassle to get a visa to visit a country, wait until china is split into many smaller one, then you will know what it means by unending hassle.
Chinese are smart to do away with visa for internal travel.

Cripes

Just because foreigners may be getting kicked out of China does not mean your chances of getting laid will increase. You will still be the same pathetic loser.

Although this demographic shift may cause the size of your penis to slightly creep up to a new position on the bell curve, you will still be at the low end of the curve because your penis is just too small -- even for a chinese guy.

@Kellen: You can vote. Remember that, ultimately, everything the US government does is indirectly caused by We the People. Now, your individual vote won't do any good, but you can do your part to influence others.

One interpretation of the comments is reveling at others' misfortune. Another interpretation is: In addition to complaining about another country's process, you should instead complain about the US's own process. That is an indirect way of solving the problem. For example, Brazil, which practices strict reciprocity, will automatically ease on Americans as soon as the US eases up on Brazilians. China does not practice strict reciprocity, but it'll be left with no excuse.

Just for fun, here are some clipping from the New York Times about the US visa process. What are we doing, deliberately trying to make enemies in the world?

"'Are you insulting me?' he asks. 'Are you insulting me, eh?'" By CHIMAMANDA NGOZI ADICHIE, November 29, 2004

"One scientist, Goverdhan Mehta, ... the former director of the Indian Institute of Science in Bangalore ... went for a routine visa interview at the consulate on Feb. 9, only to be questioned about whether his research could be used for 'chemical warfare.' Speaking Thursday from his home in Bangalore, he said it could not. He said he remembered being told he was not being honest." By SOMINI SENGUPTA, February 24, 2006

"From the Chinese perspective, the issue is simple: on the basis of interviews lasting less than five minutes, thousands of Chinese this year have found their longstanding plans for study, travel or work jettisoned. Those denied visas include students with full scholarships to Ivy League schools and grandparents wanting to see a first grandchild." By ELISABETH ROSENTHAL, September 10, 2001 -- Notice the date! Notice the date! Terrorism is just an excuse.

"Something about the whole procedure was demeaning, the couple suggested, with an air of Chekhovian world-weariness ... What has given the complaint an edge is that Poland is a major supporter of the American occupation of Iraq and has sent 2,400 troops there ... But for those who are refused, the experience acquires shades of humiliation. 'They treat you like animals,' complained Arkadiusz Dmochowski, a 23-year-old student who was waiting outside for his fiancée to complete her interview." By JOHN DARNTON, January 27, 2004

No one here is arguing that the US visa policy is not f**ked up. If somebody wants to start a blog bashing US visa policy, be my guest. I'm sure I will agree with many of your arguments.

The point is that the China visa policy is also f**ked up, and for completely different reasons. All China apologists can do is make lame moral equivalency arguments while being completely unable to argue about issues on the merits.

@anon, or michael's twin

there is a point dumbass to the new visa policies, its bc of the olympics, and the hordes of people who want to sabotage the olympics.

watch some news clippings of the torch relay, all those people, theyd want to do that in china too, so we're saying hell no.

the new visa laws were sudden and unexpected because the riots and torch relay protests were sudden and unexpected.

its a shame that legitimate foreigners have to be denied entry, but its only for a few more months so stop crying. id rather kick out some worthless english teachers that let in some saboteurs

Cripes

Unfortunately your argument, like the China visa policy argument, is completely nonsensical.

You claim that the visa policy is to keep out saboteurs, however, the foreigners which are being rejected are the ones that have been living here for years. Why would these foreigners want to jeopardize their livelihoods by protesting the olympics while in Beijing. Think about how stupid that sounds.

Anybody who wanted to sabotage the Olympics would be entering China on a tourist visa - which are still simple to obtain in the US or anywhere else. All you need is hotel and plane reservations which can easily be refunded to that person upon obtaining a the tourist visa.

its a dragnet, or should i say dragwall type strategy, yes unfortunately some legitimate foreigners get booted, but only the deadbeats who werent contributing much anyways, i'll sacrifice those for saboteurs

and saboteurs need months to plan, organize and conspire, so the past few months, just think how many of these scum didnt get in. and if some do get in, using your plan, well, they wont have much to do, bc many of their buddies didnt get in.

we'll see how many people from pakistan and syria get visas to go watch the london games.

its security measures, obviously something you know little about.

@cripes:

Anon isn't me, although I did find his comment funny. Also, I'm not working for one of those small companies or an English school like you mentioned. I'm working for a huge state-owned behemoth that should have no trouble getting visas... but there was, in fact, an error on my invitation letter, and the visa officers are being super strict.

Also... when we're talking about getting visas to the US vs. China, it's not fair to just say the US is more difficult. If you look here you can see that the U.S. has almost 40 million immigrants living in the country. China has about 4 million...

So people who get visas to the US come here to stay and live and become Americans. Of course the process for them to get visas will be more difficult than for temporary visitors to China! Is there a danger of me becoming Chinese someday and siphoning off all those wonderful state benefits?

Tom nailed it.

To Cripes and everyone else who argues that the Chinese government is just acting on what they've been saying all along--'bout time to clear out the worthless foreigners:

BEIJING -- After eight years of research and more than $2.5 million of investment, John T. McAlister is being forced to leave China.

The 71-year-old American co-founder of scientific-research company Aquabiotronic.com LLC lost his months-long battle with China's complicated visa bureaucracy last week for the right to continue living in a country he considers home. He plans to leave Friday for Bangkok, where he will set up his company, which researches commercially viable ways to sustain water and land resources in China, until he decides what to do next.

The government does indeed want to clear out "the worthless foreigners." But they don't mean the foreigners who are worthless, they mean the foreigners, who are worthless.

Funny how so many people, especially Beijing and Shanghai types, think the government looks at foreigners in China the same way that foreigners look at themselves. Uh-uh.

By the way, the US visa proceess is disgraceful. But when 500,000 Americans are living and working illegally in China--no visa at all illegally--then come back and complain about how difficult the US process is for Chinese.

Sorry, I meant to say Anon nailed it.

No one here is arguing that the US visa policy is not f**ked up. If somebody wants to start a blog bashing US visa policy, be my guest. I'm sure I will agree with many of your arguments.

The point is that the China visa policy is also f**ked up, and for completely different reasons. All China apologists can do is make lame moral equivalency arguments while being completely unable to argue about issues on the merits.

Sorry, Tom I think you also raise a point Americans can't be reminded of enough.

Yeah, I did the 1-year teaching-English-in-China thing. It was a great way to see the country--and some of my students may actually have learned something. Some English teachers are legitimate, many are not.

My take on the situation--hey, it's their country, they can let in and keep out whoever they want. We don't have some god-given a right to live there. I presume that academics with serious research projects will be able to get in; the rest of us can come as tourists like everyone else.

It looks like the "cripes" dude saw the girl he had a crush on (and who was not interested in him at all to begin with) being stolen by a cool english teacher from the US.

As anon said, even if there are less foreigners, that will not give him any chance to get laid. The poor dude will be one of the few dozen millions of chinese men who will never get a woman.

Cripes, don't blame the foreigners, blame the peasants who kill their daughters; if they didn't you could have got a peasant's daughter as your only beloved wife.

oh my jun takes it to a new extreme.

but @cripes,

I was waiting for you to jump down Michael's throat when he posted this vulnerable...

could you explain for us just who you actually hate, it all seems a little conflated to me.

Is it 'foreigners' in general; 'Americans'; or the 'US'.

In your rabid ramblings you seem to confuse the three all over the place. Please clarify for the discerning reader.

example of deadbeat foreigner Anon, Jun

these perverts who couldnt get laid back home in rural america come to asia bc now, they are mister exotic westerner.

these perverts are the same deadbeat foreigners im talking about, arrogant western men, who think they are god's gift.

these perverts who disrespect women, exploit the developing world, they prance around disrespecting the culture and people.

and the thing about white boys are, the minute you insult them, they bring out some sexual insult, which is what black men have levied at them in their hometowns, so now they feel its their turn.

you are the exact type of foreigner that give the legitimate foreigners a bad name, and its safe to say, i think most chinese are happy these drunken perverts who run around the entertainment districts causing trouble and noise are sent home.

at reobuck

i dont like michael because he supports separatists, all be it subtly. he provides a haven for china haters, and separatists, and in a way encourages them with his blogs entries.

if some mexican immigrant went to america and started blogging, and talking about the "reconquista" (anon, you might have to google it, seeing you're uneducated), and letting other mexicans bash america, and talk about america's dismemberment, would you feel sorry he got kicked out of america?

@Cripes,
How dare a mexican immigrant blog about the reconquest of the Iberian peninsula centuries ago. If one more comes up to me speaking of the defeat of the Berbers, I will join the Minutemen immediately.

to the uneducated post above

there are two reconquistas retard, the one that kicked out the moors from spain, and the one where mexicans want to reclaim the south west US and california for mexico.

damn micahel, seems like the education level of your commenters isnt as high as you thought it was.

@sweet lou: awesome.

@Tom, re: brasil: that's exactly what i was saying. the rest was mostly direct response to stuff said earlier, mostly quotes without quotation marks.

@cripes: so, you just want to kick out the perverts then? korea's got stricter visa restrictions (i'm told by friends) due to a pedophile. fair enough. that i can totally agree with. but then that's not consistent with your thing about saboteurs. and it still doesn't answer for all the people who've been living here for years.

i'm leaving china in a week as well due to visa issues (among other reasons). but mark my words, cripes: i'll be back. and who knows, i might even see my girlfriend again when i do. sends chills down your spine, doesn't it?

Cripes wrote: "let me break it down for everyone. If you're a young western male, who works for a company that doesnt do shit, i.e. teach english or its nets sales are less than that of a street vendor, chances are, the visa offices are going to be like, "deadbeat foreigner, visa denied, NEXT!" All these foreigners do for china is fill the coffers of sunlitun(r)"

Or if China were really serious about getting rid of the "deadbeats" and making a place like Xinjiang a better place, then maybe they should be focussing less on English teachers and more on the countless "deadbeat" Han who come to Xinjiang in droves, demand all the basic-skilled jobs, and deny a minority in their own "Autonomous" region, the right to basic subsistance.

@ intellectually crippled cripes:

"these perverts who couldnt get laid back home in rural america come to asia bc now, they are mister exotic westerner.

these perverts are the same deadbeat foreigners im talking about, arrogant western men, who think they are god's gift."

Eh, now these two paragraphs are so full of frustration that I wonder whether you broke your keyboard when typing them.
As you underline it, "we are perverts who couldnt get laid in rural America" (nvm we are not all Americans and majoritarily from urban areas), that is to say losers, but we can still get all the women here? What does it mean, that you are at a level below losers? Jealousy and despise don't go well together, cripes. What you are feeling is plain jealousy. I will save you the trouble to look this up; "jealous" means 嫉妒. (you'll all notice both characters, which are rather derogatory, have the woman 女 component, which is pretty convenient here in reminding us how the Chinese who "respect" women indeed associate the beautiful gender with anything pejorative or negative).

"these perverts who disrespect women, exploit the developing world, they prance around disrespecting the culture and people."

Either these perverts are businessmen and then they exploit the developing world but you're glad to have them come to your country to develop it, or they're english teachers and you actually did invite them to help your country to learn that language they speak over there, you know, english.

"and the thing about white boys are, the minute you insult them, they bring out some sexual insult, which is what black men have levied at them in their hometowns, so now they feel its their turn."

Hehe now this is funny... Unfortunately many Chinese girls are rather racist towards black men (thanks God not all) so China is pretty good for white men who, as you said, can't get laid in America (or in other countries you've never heard of). BTW how do you know I'm not black?

Want to hear me quote how a girl last week told me "Now I did it with you I can never fall into a Chinese man's arms again?" Sorry but I need to provoke a little bit more your frustration - hopefully you'll stop spamming this blog with your aggressive unjustified comments. Michael is a cool dude who doesn't deserve this permanent sh*t.

"you are the exact type of foreigner that give the legitimate foreigners a bad name, and its safe to say, i think most chinese are happy these drunken perverts who run around the entertainment districts causing trouble and noise are sent home."

Well, my working permit + visa + flat have all been renewed last month because China still wants me to stay. Wrong person?

Before you all consider me to be the evil western man, to metaphrase Rousseau I have to say that I was born innately good, but it was Chinese society, despite all its flamboyant harmonious characteristics, which corrupted me.
Evil, evil China.

Cripes, Rousseau is called 卢梭 in Chinese. Read what he wrote, it's pretty cool. Even if he's one guy from some of those countries you probably hate, Switzerland/France (if you've heard about them, that is).

@mikes,

"...when 500,000 Americans are living and working illegally in China--no visa at all illegally--then come back and complain about how difficult the US process is for Chinese."

This has nothing to do with the visa process. The American ruling class just likes its cheap labor.

Just thought I'd point that out. Please carry on with the fascinating debate on the comparative size difference of black, white and yellow wee-wees, folks...

haha, wow, i must have really pissed jun off, he wrote us his Phd thesis, and even looked up some characters too. buddy, my english is better than yours, so please, save your fingers the agony of typing.

prob took you all day to write that huh?

chinese girls mostly go with western guys bc they want green cards and to learn english, not bc your a stallion there big jun.

i love how white boys always over generalize and think all chinese guys cant get girls. any chinese girl would pick me over your trailer trash ass bc they can learn english, and not have the shame of being seen with a white man.

most chinese people think that a chinese girl who dates westerners is a slut, thus she feels shes losing face when shes in public with you.

lets face it jun, you came to the developing world bc back home, youd be nothing, you know, i know it,

we call people like you back home losers, but bc your from the west you get noticed all over the developing world, not just china.

all im saying is, im happy michael got denied his visa bc he's a separatist lover, period. all this other shit about deadbeat foreigners is a side issue, the main point is, im happy that someone who wants to divide my country got his visa denied. but seeing how lenient my country still is, he will prob get back in eventually. its just a delicious irony that im savoring right now. haha.

You see there's the thing Cripes, "Your country" is so obviously a false statement. You're an American Born Chinese who, like so many of your expatriate community members, has gone to China and realised that being both American and Chinese gives you best of both worlds: You can date countless Chinese women, be the man “you” were not back home, and as you so rightly pointed out, not inflict onto them the usual small-minded stereotypes routinely levelled by either the old, the uneducated or xenophobic locals.

Now I'm really sorry that somewhere along the line you didn't get picked in your high school basketball team on account for being too short and not being much good from the outside, or that you lost your girl to a white guy because she soon realised you're quite insecure, clingy and borderline misogynist; confirmed racist. You write moderately well, and it appears you see yourself as a bit of a writer. There is a general belief that writers are at once very creative and terribly insecure. Keep working on the first part there sport, you’re half way there. You need to elevate your writing above verbal diarrhoea. Ta, have a rosy day.

Whoa, angry comments! I was just going to wish you luck, and hope that your employer is as legit as they're making themselves out to be, and you don't look shady, and no one in the visa office is having a bad day, and generally, that you get your visa without tai mafan.

If you don't get back into the middle kingdom quickly, we should meet up, I'm going to be back in NJ on my own visa vacation in a few weeks.

@ cripes re:

"if some mexican immigrant went to america and started blogging, and talking about the "reconquista" (anon, you might have to google it, seeing you're uneducated), and letting other mexicans bash america, and talk about america's dismemberment, would you feel sorry he got kicked out of america? "

Cripes this is plain unmitigated crap.

You argue like the 'conquest' ( your admission/your guilt trip) of Xinjiang is a fait accompli caomparable to soemthing which happened in the new world centuries ago. Unlike Mexico, the imperial/colonial genociodal sinicization of Xinjiang is a happening as we speak; and it is not a proven fait accompli. China may bust right up the guts before too long for all you know. So stop the ahistorical comparisons, despite your vile bile toward bloggers most people here are actually intelligent and educated and know their historical facts as well as what is really going in terms of cultural genocideon out west of Qinghai Hu these days.

@ cripes agin

"chinese girls mostly go with western guys bc they want green cards and to learn english, not bc your a stallion there big jun."

Isnt that the beauty of it cripes? Chinese gals would screw their asses off for adavantage- to learn a language or a piece of material matter of a green colour to get to the states - so why not deceive them screw all night and day and take advantage of them just like they are taking advantage of you. next please. I cant wait to lay my next dopey Chinese gal. hmmmmmm.....

as afar as visas for Chinese citizens go.

lets get real as well.

Travel the world and see how many mainland Han swarm over most western cities of the world these days, many of them as 'students'. Try England, US , Australia, etc.

The reason some governments make it tough is bc China in fact is such a rotten place to live countless millions of Han would flee the place if given the chance - anybody who has spent any time in China knows that is true - millions upon millions. So China is not about to be over run by big noses. Chinese visa restrictions are just nasty crap from the egotistical/ racist heart of the CCP. If you want to take it to the limit: then make it China for the Chinese just like the days leading up to the ass kick that was the Opium war(s). Now that would stop all those nice degreees in business management now wouldnt it from western universities?, and as well the right to residence in those countries.

China extra charges on Americans for visas to China is another piece of biased/prejudiced institutional robbery lao weis have become used to in China under the old rubric "but you are a 'rich' country" . The other present 'olympian' strictures as posted here are simply paranoia and the 'control' demons at work again in a time when Chinas tranished prestiege is vulnerable andd open to be even more tarnished; it also serves to enforce CCP 'terrorist' propaganda and screw the Uyghur and Bod even more.

This tit for tat argument over visa availability is really without justification, and a waste of time as it is simply another petty way China reveals its true character ...oh...that is apart from loyal Han commentators like cripes.

Hi Mike, I just dont understand why you have to exit China to get a Z visa (working) or go to HK for that. Our Z visas are processed here by our employers. We just need to fill out forms and go thru the regular med check.

In fact, a friend got his Z visa just recently with no problems.

O_O

What we have been hearing here is problems getting a business/tourist visa?

Let me just say for the record: "Cripes," you're a racist, xenophobic, jingoistic cocksucker and a threat to China's stability. Such primitive thinking should be held as an act of sedition and you should face the maximum penalty for it, since your xenophobia continues to paint China in an unfair, negative light and only perpetuates the pigeon holing that holds China back.

Mike: good luck and may your visa issue be resolved promptly.

Roebuck, cool down a bit.

China is swollen in population that is by far the most important reason that many are looking for a fortune elsewhere. Added that in the last century China was both physically and mentally frustrated, unprepared for dramatic changes. But what is the problem of "swarm" other places? Didn't Caucausians swarm the World?

Canada is even more verbal in criticizing China but the $100 is only on US. SEVIS is crap. Lots of visa refusals at any US consulate don't make people happy, either. You know US visa refusal rates rock quite often and there isn't a hell lot explanation about it. Crap for crap, not too bad.

"racist heart of the CCP". Alas, I wish you see what the Chinese college students have on this topic.

"make it China for the Chinese just like..." sorry, where is President Monroe? It is not at all necessary given the Chinese population and pressure of living there.

One tiny mistake can cost you when applying for visas now. Even renewing a residence permit and FEC with the same employer has gotten more difficult. Unfortunately, the people who work for companies/schools that are in charge of obtaining visas for foreigners no longer know what the rules are.

My co-worker actually found it easier to get a Canadian visa for her husband than getting him a Chinese visa.

I heard from Uyghur friends living in the United States (those who got permanent residency or citizenship) that their visa application to China has been rejected on the grounds of their being Uyghur. It didn't matter if they're active on the Uyghur expat activities or not ...

The Chinese aren't making it absurdly difficult to get visas because of any policies of the US visa authorities - they are doing it because they are paranoid and uncaring. Foreigners are simply being exposed to the same sort of senseless bureaucracy that Chinese people are subjected to by their gov't everyday. The anger toward China that their policy is generating will be deserved.

While the US visa officers can often be irritating you often run into individual officers willing to make decisions, go out on a limb, and help applicants. That seems to never be the case with Chinese visa officers - all of whom are afraid to stick their neck out or help anyone. Of course the US has a real big problem with illegal immigrants. Very very few people want to illegally immigrate to China so China's paranoia is not founded on reality.

I do not think the argument that "it's difficult for Chinese to get visas to the US, so China has every right to do the same to Americans" holds much water. Here's why. The reasons why visas for Chinese going to the US are so difficult to obtain are purely economical. A typical Chinese migrant worker makes between 1000 RMB and 1700 RMB per month. Doing the same kind of job in the US, one could easily make $10 to $12 USD per hour. You don't need to do the math to know that there is an enormous economic potential for Chinese going to the United States to work. Because of this, it is entirely reasonable to assume that a large quantity of Chinese citizens, if given tourist visas, would likely stay in the US and work for years. This is not a racist or over-generalized statement either, it's just the way it is. As an American, if I could wash dishes in Canada for $250 an hour, you bet your ass I would be jumping over the fence (which would be there if such an economic desparity existed) just to go over and work for a few years.

After living in Fujian for 3 years, I can say with confidence, that if the US were giving out Chinese visas left and right, at least half of the province's population would be in New York city washing dishes and cooking General Tso's chicken (many of them already are). As it stands right now, there is already a massive amount of Fujian ren in the US working illegally. While I don't personally have any qualms with this (they are only acting in the best interests of their families), this is the main reason it is so difficult for Chinese people to get visas to the United States.

So if Chinese people want to point their fingers at one group of people and blame them for the difficulty in getting visas, it should probably be on all the illegals from Fujian who make it more difficult for other Chinese to go abroad.

But the real fact of the matter is that any time you have a situation where going from country A to country B is marginally more advantageous than going from country B to country A, country B is going to have to be pretty strict about who comes in and out. It's just a matter of economics.

"I'm working for a huge state-owned behemoth that should have no trouble getting visas".

Are you working for CCTV?

I'M LIKE TOTALLY DATING THIS CHINESE CHICK

So, hola, folks, I gotta tell you about this awesome experience I'm having teaching English here in old Zhongguoland (thats "China", to you outsiders). Anyways, I was like slavin' at this real dead end gig at Larry's Tires in Janesville, WI, when I met up with this way cool dude (even though he was Chinese) who tells me like if your bored and can't get laid why don't you try your luck teaching English in China? Well anyways, my boss Larry was about to can me just because I sometimes come to work late and don't let him know before (hey, how do I know if I'm gonna be late? Am I a freakin' fortuneteller)? So what the hell, I check out some sites on the company 'puter (can't afford one of my own), and I find a real job IN CHINA! teaching English (just fudged a tiny bit on my application, so what they gonna do, spend like 50 bucks to call and check my phony credentials out? Yeah, right)!

So anyways, after bumming the airfare off my mom and dad, here I am in this place called Wuwei (they pronounce it Woooo-wayyy. Cool!) In freakin' Gansu Province out in the middle of nowhere. But then I find--check this out, man--cannibis growin' wild along the road. Yeah, that right, FREE WEED! How frickin' cool is that?! It's kinda weak, you gotta toke twice as much as usual to get wasted, but who's bitching, its there for the taking! Just be careful, like don't show up for your classes stoned, the Chinese are a reaaal pain about shit like that. But aside from that, the gigs cool...like them Chinese (just remember, don't say "chinks", that's not cool here), anyways, they don't know nothin' here about credentials or qualifications or no shit like that. And they think your cool just 'cause your some foreign dude!

So, I'm bikin' around town after class when I run into this chick! I say sorry, but she doesn't even get mad or nothin' like an American chick would, she just smiles. First thing I notice is her killer bod--she got boobies that wiggle and bounce when she moves. Then I remember that I need to look at her face, right, 'cause she's like talkin' to me. Woah--a chick talkin' to me instead of givin' me the old slap down like usual. She speaks pretty good English like a lotta these Chink...I mean Chinese do, and we're shootin' the breeze for maybe 15 minutes and then I'm like how would you like to come to my pad for a beer and she's like YES! Wow! I ain't scored for like years with none of them stuck-up American chicks...and this Chinese doll is such a righteous BABE!! So anyways, we go to my pad and I get more action that night than I ever had in my life just because I'm a friggin' American dude! God bless Uncle Sham (I mean Sam, yeah right, heh-heh)!!

So, like teaching English in China is a real cool gig, even if they call you a "loser" or whatever crap they say in your home...but now the Chinese are starting to get wise and giving you all kinds of shit and such when you try to renew your visa. So hurry up, get over here before they completely wise up and spoil the game (and the chicks and the food is awesome, and if you like come here to Gansu or Xinjiang you don't even have to bring your stash with you either). AWESOME!!

Jay said: "While the US visa officers can often be irritating you often run into individual officers willing to make decisions, go out on a limb, and help applicants. That seems to never be the case with Chinese visa officers - all of whom are afraid to stick their neck out or help anyone."

I might add that a local PBS officer in Beijing got me out of a sticky spot when I thought I would have to leave (Visa probs). To be sure, at first she was as cold as a frozen mullet, but after a bit of small-talk she warmed up and became very very helpful indeed. She bent quite a few rules to extend my visa. So, while I don't disagree with you Jay because for the most part what you say is true, there are some who are willing to "put themselves out on a limb," albeit a minority.

@gao

China is swollen in population that is by far the most important reason that many are looking for a fortune elsewhere. Added that in the last century China was both physically and mentally frustrated, unprepared for dramatic changes. But what is the problem of "swarm" other places? Didn't Caucausians swarm the World?

You totally miss the point you nong head and distort my meaning. Oh the Europeans swarmed the world. Sure. Now its China's turn. Right. Come one. Come all. populate our lands dear Chinese elder brothers, come and swarm. Bring your totalitarian fearful, outdated, prudish ideology and please, please, torture us and execute us when we disagree, come China, because there are so many of you , come , come and takeover the world.

Cool down! You are throwback gao. And I hope to god you are never let out of your happy little kingdom. You answer nothing I point to in my post ;its a basic Han whitewash and diversion typical of Han commentators on this post so piss off and stop insulting us with your low level reasoning; and the basic issue is that the Chinese visa policy is racist on purely racist grounds mixed with its innate xenophobic paranoia. US visa restrictions are to keep the swarm out. I mean how many fucked in the head Chinese like Gao do you really want in your country?

Gao How dare you justify that expansion on the grounds you did. Go back to your Opium War mentality loser

Some more thoughts on Cripes postings above

re:

"if some mexican immigrant went to america and started blogging, and talking about the "reconquista" (anon, you might have to google it, seeing you're uneducated), and letting other mexicans bash america, and talk about america's dismemberment, would you feel sorry he got kicked out of america?"

the big difference between what America did to Mexican land and what China is doing to Turkestani land is this:

1. America took part of Mexican land. and pushed Mexico's borders back to where they are today below Texas and New Mexico and California.

2. China has taken ALL of Turkestani land and has pushed them up against a wall while flooding the place with Han xenophobes like Cripes and Gao.

3. If the situation was at all comparable China would have taken say just HAMI, ALTAY and maybe TURPAN and the rest of Turkestan would have remained Turkestani rather than the colonial dominion of the 'new' jiang. So as we see, figuratively speaking China took all of 'Mexico'. or should I say is in the process of taking 'all' of Mexico. Thats right its still the 19th. century in terms of Chinese colonial thinking

There are other implications to the comparison I will leave to your imagination (not yours Cripes, but thanks for the opportunity to show how inadequat, racist and outdated your desperate reasonings are).

You asked was it a contest?

If refusing "legitimate" Visas (work, student, tourist) was an Olympic Event, the USA would win the Gold, Silver, and Bronze medals hands down setting new world as well as Olympic records.

Even with a US Visa for business trip, My wife's relatives have been detained by US Customs, question, and put through the wringer, each time under the threat of being placed on an airplane. And this is after going through channels to get permission to travel to the US. And an invite. And he does regular business "importing" from the US to China.

You probably never heard of the Chinese (later to become the Oriental) Exclusion Act. That was law of the land from 1882 to 1965. Racism with a Capital "R". There was talk of Expulsion of the Chinese during the Yellow Peril era.

The Brazil "reciprocal treatment" wasn't very bad treatment, so at least the US treats Brazil better than China, at least I didn't see the same hoops Mainland Chinese have to jump through, I just had to spend money in advance of travel and then stand in line, a shorter line than to enter the UK, and less trouble than Canada gave my brother in law for entering when we were traveling together.

As to the commenter thinking it is economic, Mexico currency exchange rate didn't stop the US from blocking Mexican citizens from working, traveling, ect. Mexico is less than 7% of the planet's population, but they are 70% of the immigrants (and higher still for Citizenship) into the US. A brit from the UK trying to get a work Visa permit (unless a Doctor) has even more trouble, than Mexican Citizen.

Try getting a work Visa to work in Mexico. Then experience the hoops Gringos have to jump though to work in Mexico.

I had a tenant (well I sublet a room) "collected" by Homeland security at 6 am in the morning. Well they first said they were Federal Police., FBI? doing a murder investigation. The two officers were in full SWAT regalia including open holsters with what look like 9mm revolvers. After collecting every male in my rental house, they shackled "Jose" his real name, and left with this warning, don't look outside for 2 minutes or it will be dangerous for you. Like there were snipers ready to pick us off. Jose's work Visa had expired. He was on a bus to Mexico in less than 24 hours.

So you having it tough. Well I guess it builds character. Maybe you won't make stupid remarks next time you apply for a Visa.

Ben Ross said it better than I could. The US is awash in illegal Chinese immigrants and that is the reason that applicants for US visas get a hard time - because of their fellow Chinese - the lawbreaking ones. Whether or not a country gets on the visa waiver program depends on the rate of their fellow citizens overstaying their visas. Right now there are 40,000 Chinese detained in the US for visa violations AND the Chinese gov't refuses to take them back! So, Ben is right, Chinese have only themselves to blame for the difficulty they face getting visas. On the other hand, how many Americans or Europeans are there in China illegally?

I like redneck bumper sticker`USA, love it or leave it'

The same thing apply to China. China haters better stay away. Any turmoil will end up with genocide of foreigners or minorities. Smart Jews get out of Germany with slight smell of trouble.

Foreigners beware.

非我族类，其心必异. Forefathers words were never wrong.

@fkjay:

"I like redneck bumper sticker`USA, love it or leave it."

Yep. Stupid rednecks are the same the world over.

@ jay

Yes thats another big reason why many Chinese have a hard time getting visas; they overstay; work illegally with no respect to the laws of the country; basiclly live a life of deception within the country they stay illegally for their own benefit with no thought for that country itself; this is the same complaint the Uyghur have of the Han in Xinjiang - all they want to do is milk the land dry of profit and give nothing back but their ersatz modernity. Suck, squeeze, pillage; and see how they cry here bout not getting visas. Hah.

and Wouldnt you just love fkjay as your neighbour?

@ jay

Yes thats another big reason why many Chinese have a hard time getting visas; they overstay; work illegally with no respect to the laws of the country; basiclly live a life of deception within the country they stay illegally for their own benefit with no thought for that country itself; this is the same complaint the Uyghur have of the Han in Xinjiang - all they want to do is milk the land dry of profit and give nothing back but their ersatz modernity. Suck, squeeze, pillage; and see how they cry here bout not getting visas. Hah.

and Wouldnt you just love fkjay as your neighbour?

@ Roebuck, aka James

we all know its you so stop pretending and hiding under another name coward.

your argument is flawed, the partial conquest of mexico, is the same as China's partial conquest of central asia.

china took part of turkestan just like america took part of mexico.

@spec

"all they want to do is milk the land dry of profit and give nothing back but their ersatz modernity. Suck, squeeze, pillage;"

i think you just described every western company's corporate strategy regarding the developing world.

western corporations have been like a swarm of locusts, destroying the environment, pillaging resources and exploiting people. but thats a topic for another day.

and its not just china, all developing countries have hordes of visa violators.

but, according to the attitude of many commenters here, it is legitimate for a government to implement a hardline policy that will keep out a few bad apples at the expense of legitimate travelers.

there you go, china's wants to keep out a few bad apples (terrorists, and saboteurs) and tragically innocent people are effected, except it, swallow it, and stop crying and coming up with your hypocritical arguments.

@ cripes

I wasnt speaking about corporatioons so you have skewed the point here. I was speaking about dishonest illegal immigrants. Big difference. On your point to Roebuck, then does all of Central Asia aka Turkestan according to your admission and your logic have aright to protest the robbery of its land by China? After all it is really a colonial possesion and not really part of China. Thats the implication of your statement.

@ cripes again

sorry I meant to include:

40,000 illegal Chiense immigrants a year that are known of in America alone (there are many more unaccounted for) is more than just a few of your so called 'bad apples' Id say.

@cripes

oh it just keeps coming:

the "swarm" of faceless locusts is what the Uighur called the Han who invaded their land in the 1930s. Read warlords and Muslims in Chinese Central Asia by Forbes for the ref. What were they to do then let alone now!

I think the difference between America- Mexico and China-Turkestan are really two very different situations, and incomaparable.

The conquest you speak of is still under way - the territorial advancing colonial frontier is genocidal in its outworking throughout history, wherever. Do you support genocide in Turkestan Mr. Cripes?

@spec

very few people cry foul over what america did, so china should also get that treatment, because while america has only held that territory for about 150 years, china has had sovereignty over xinjiang for over a thousand years. so our right is greater

if you call what is happening in xinjiang genocide, then genocide is happening everywhere, west bank, gaza, iraq, south west usa, hawaii, alaska. but you dont call those policies genocide, so ours isnt either.

the guys in washington neglect and treat african americans worse than beijing treats uighurs. PERIOD. just check the incarceration rates, and execution rates of blacks in america compared to their proportion of the US population.

the way paris treats its muslims is worse again. period.

the way japan treats its minorities, the Ainu is worse, period.

you are one of these separatist supporters, dont want to waste my breath on you.

this argument has been cried many times before, its getting boring to repeat my words and hear yours again. so if you want to criticize me, lets keep it fresh and to the topic, about how im a prick for laughing at michael's visa rejection.

save your separatists propaganda for the uneducated people that you socialize with on the weekends.

@cripes: You're a prick, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Wow...Long thread...

I just went through visa hell in HK. I got a 3 month single entry. And they said I was lucky to get that. I have had 4 one-year multiples prior to that...The old L visa is functionally dead for now...

As far as tit-for-tat: The US issues more RESIDENT visas to Chinese in 3 days than China does to ALL foreigners in a year. And now 90% of all visa requests to the US are being approved so says the Consul General of HK...95% of those from HK and Macau...It does take a bit longer...And the likelihood of Americans, Aussies, Canucks, Brits, ect. overstaying--for illegal immigration--is much smaller in China than the other way around...It is not a good policy...

Down south here many factories are considering moving out as QA inspectors cannot get to their products to have to have them shipped to HK now...The economic impact on the average citizen is going to be huge

The problem is: China brought in 67 Billion in tourism dollars this year. Tourism is now down 20% due to the visa mess. This affects the poorest areas the most after Beijing and the Great Wall gawkers...20% of 67 Billion is more than has been donated worldwide to aid earthquake victims.

It is a poorly thought out policy...

I hope it works out Michael...

I had a little giggle at this: Cripes included in almost the same breath, "..china has had sovereignty over xinjiang for over a thousand years." and then "save your separatists propaganda for the uneducated people that you socialize with on the weekends."

1000 years you say? Well, let's take a stroll down memory lane, shall we.

When in the late 1120’s the Jin Dynasty destroyed the Khitay State (Mongol speakers that ruled Northern China from 907-1125) one of its royal members, Yelu Dashi, fled to Mongolia and amassed an Army that subsequently seized Beshbaliq (near Urumqi) from the people now known as the Uighur. I believe their empire ruled over both Uighur and Karahanid (who introduced Islam into Xinjiang) and extended from the Amu River in the west to the Tangut lands and eastern Mongolia in the east, and from Siberia to Balkh (northern Afghanistan) and Khotan in the south. Thus the Kara Khitay poses a Challenge to Cripes’ wish to ascribe simple historical identities to Xinjiang.

Also at around 1209, when Genghis Khan united the Mongolian Tribes, the Uighur were getting a bit jack about the Khitay’s high tributary demands, so the region saw a switch of allegiance from Dashi’s Khitay to Genghis’ Mongolian empire. And when that old war-horse Genghis died in 1227 the issue of sovereignty over Xinjiang became an even more complicated matter. Although appearing neat in appearance, the division of his empire amongst his sons sowed the seeds of centuries of instability, particularly on the territory of the former Kara Khitay.

I won’t bore you with the rest of the Mongol’s fragmentary rule, however, it is clear that until the eighteenth century no Chinese dynasty had continuously controlled for any length of time or governed in any thoroughgoing way the entire territory of modern-day Xinjiang. To be sure, the Han and the Tang dynasties had settled the Turpan area and established isolated garrisons elsewhere. The Mongol Yuan in theory briefly kept all of China and Central Eurasia under the one Khan, though the fault lines of this empire are all too visible. Cripes, who claim that "..china has had sovereignty over xinjiang (sic) for over a thousand years..." only has rhetoric on his side.

Propoganda…uneducated…. Yep, you said it Cripes.

Michael, why don’t I teach you some Chinese condemning words for fun? I wish you could use it not just on Cripes, but those had racey, demeaning remarks here.

你瞎了狗眼、瘸了猪脚、断了鸡爪、咬了猫舌、昏了猴脑, TNND!

As to visa, it is too bad, even with personal “visa hell”, some people here still have no sympathy towards those who experienced the same, and apparently it happens on both sides. Before everyone argues it to death and throw all the numbers in for the good measurement, some of us just want to be treated as a human by America visa officers. That will be a good start, then we can talk about “fairness”.

China police kill 5 members of separatist group

By CHRISTOPHER BODEEN – 1 hour ago

BEIJING (AP) — Police shot and killed five members of an alleged radical Islamic separatist group in the far west of China as Beijing tightened security ahead of next month's Olympic Games, state media reported Wednesday.

Two members of the group were hospitalized following a police raid on a hideout in Urumqi, capital of the northwestern territory of Xinjiang, the Xinhua News Agency said. Eight others were arrested, it said.

Xinhua said the group, which included five women, brandished knives and swore to fight to the death after more than a dozen police officers surrounded their apartment.

"The suspects confessed they had all received training on the launching of a 'holy war,'" Xinhua said.

Xinhua said the group was dedicated to establishing an independent Muslim state in Xinjiang and slaughtering members of China's majority Han ethnic group who have streamed into the region, 1,500 miles west of Beijing, since it was occupied by communist troops in 1949.

The reports come amid a nationwide security crackdown ahead of the Beijing Olympics that has targeted militants and government critics in Xinjiang and the Himalayan region of Tibet, the scene of deadly anti-government rioting earlier this year.

Authorities have previously accused Xinjiang separatists of attempting to crash an airliner in March and planning to kidnap athletes and journalists during the games.

At a rally for Olympic organizers in Beijing on Wednesday, Chinese Vice President Xi Jinping called security the single most important task for organizers in the runup to the games.

"A safe Olympics is the biggest indicator of the success of the games," Xi, tasked with supervising overall Olympic preparations, said in a speech at the Great Hall of the People, the seat of China's legislature.

"A safe Olympics is also a key indicator of the positive reflection of our nation's image," he said, underscoring the massive national prestige communist leaders have invested in the Aug. 8-24 games.

China claims Tibetan forces allied with the exiled Dalai Lama and Xinjiang separatists are seeking to torpedo the games with violent plots, including the use of suicide bombers. No evidence has been provided to support the claims, while critics accuse Beijing of using terrorism accusations to silence even peaceful dissent and often portraying ordinary criminal acts or civil unrest as terrorist-inspired in a bid to win public support.

Like Tibetans, Xinjiang's indigenous Uighur ethnic group has a language and culture distinct from that of China's Han ethnic majority, and extremists among them have waged a low-intensity struggle against Chinese rule for decades. Many have been sentenced to long prison terms or death on separatism charges.

Xinhua said police had been hunting the Xinjiang gang since they attacked a beauty salon in May and were forced to fire on the group Wednesday when they charged out of the apartment after tear gas was fired into it.

Calls to the police spokesman's office in Urumqi rang unanswered Wednesday, and a security guard at the Chenguan Garden community where the raid reportedly occurred hung up the phone when asked about the incident.

Beijing typically blames attacks in the area on the East Turkestan Islamic Movement, a militant group that demands separation from China, and which Washington claims is linked with al-Qaida.

Despite China's claims that terrorism is the main threat to the games, security experts say there is only a faint likelihood of attacks because of strict social controls.

Copyright © 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

"New Dominion"'s analysis about the 'terror' incident:

http://www.thenewdominion.net/210/knife-wielding-mini-terrorist-cell-busted-in-urumqi/

Violent gang or terrorist group....? Ai, Beijing really needs to work on gathering evidence before opening its big unrealiable mouth. "Confessions" are notroiously unreliable.

oh, heard it late last night on the radio, the commentataor mispronouncing Urumqi, Xinjiang and WEEEGUAR; but it seems another case of those 'violent' separatists with knives hole dup in an appartment block then gunned down by heavily armed fascists to me. Why do these violent separatists only ever have knives or unexplodable home - made bombs. Its aways the same case?. God the CCP must think we are stupid. May peace rest upon the souls of the murdered.

as far as that nasty little skunk Cripes goes

try 750 AD the period of the withdrawal of the 4 garrisons from the Tarim basin until 1759 the Qing annexation of the Tarim basin for a thousand years of no-Han control of Turkestan. And the Qing were not even Han. So lets push it to 1888 and Zou Zang Tang, to make it roughly 1200 years when the Han were not in Xinjiang. The Tang dynasty influence and control is also open to debate. Cripes why does it not surprise me that you are a total ignorant when it comes to history I ask myself.Predictable and humorous, also very sad.

Some one compare china with american's taking over of mexican territories, its absurb. Uighur or tibetan were land owner then and now, their land were never taken away. This is absolutely different from the white settlers that taken over land that belong to the mexican. Mexican were chased out of newly conquered area or murdered if they strayed into white ranches, this is true even today. Other differences are language and religion, all minority learn and speak their own language and observed their own religion in china, may I ask what is the original language and religion of the black?

African Americans (sic)

It is indeed unnatural that these suspects are equipped with knives. No that effective for a jihad whatever. From time to time there are news that some farmers blow houses up with untended potassium nitrate.

Don't know what police are doing in Xijiang these days, but in general people have doubt on their competence and the five cops being knived to death in Shanghai receives a lot of frowning. Btw most Police officers (even in action) are not armored in China. Some even don't have guns. Don't let half-life dictate your image of people that fight 'terrorists'.

Gao

You come across like you know the facts. But seriously. Paramilitary or special unit armed police are used agins5t these knife weilding 'gng' members. When was the last tiem you were in Urumqi, please tell? If you really knew what you were talking baout and had been there as you obviiously have not you would see on a daily basis , blue clad special police units armed to the teeth with automatic weapons patrolling Urumqi streets, these are a mixture of Han , Uyghur police. They have a special little station which adjoins the 'Uyghur' fantasy land bazaaar in Er Dai Qiao. Which units were used in this week's massacre? Who knows, but not your passive types without weapons. Please no more idiotic postings which are factually wrong and which you know absolutely nothing about.

btw what is 'untended potassium nitrate.' , these devious farmers use?

Police Detain 82 Suspected Terrorists in Xinjiang

Editor:Angel K. Yan
Source:
Updated: 2008-7-10 16:05:53

Chinese police cracked five terrorism groups in the country's northwest Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region in the first half of 2008, detaining 82 suspected terrorists who allegedly plotted sabotage against the Beijing Olympics, an official said.

Chen Zhuangwei, head of the Public Security Bureau of Urumqi, made the remarks on Wednesday at a conference here on Olympic security, local media reported on Thursday.

Police in the regional capital also detained 66 gang members of the "three evil forces" of terrorism, separatism and extremism, and destroyed 41 training bases of "holy war" from January to June, Chen said.

During the period, local police cracked 16 cases of the Falun Gong cult, detained 25 suspects and destroyed seven illegal workshops of reactionary propaganda material for Falun Gong, he said.

In addition, local police arrested 217 members from 51 gangs accused of violent crimes such as robbery and seized 268 wanted suspects, he said.

"The number of criminal cases dropped 12.6 percent (compared with the same period last year)," Chen said. But both figures were not available for now.

The Olympic torch relay was held successfully on June 17 in Urumqi and that was a "significant victory" in the first phase of the Olympic security work in Xinjiang, he said.

"The second phase has begun. All police must continue to work hard and increase the fight against terrorism, the 'three evil forces,' criminal cases, drug crimes and other violent crimes, so as to provide solid work for the Olympic security and ensure the stability of the regional capital," he said.

http://news.rednet.cn/c/2008/07/10/1548444.htm

Terrorism arrests from last year are up, Crime from last year is down..... do the maths....

Where is Urumqi?

"Where is Urumqi?" - on the other side of the moon

Near YourAnus?

Jimba - bad syntax and grammar as ever.

Go Cripes

... implies competition.... Better to be the great cacographer than a cheerleader who wears the skirt in a relationship of fools.

Toodles :)

PS: Promise to spell better if you promise to be a little smarter.

Michael, deal with these idiots because your blog is quickly becoming a joke.

Haha! A joke. I'm laughing.